5.3 reaction
Sep. 25th, 2009 02:13 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
fannishlissall spoilers all the time.
Here is my reaction:
ARRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHH!
Here is how I am coping:
1. I immediately got out my doll of Sam's Evil Twin and dressed him as Lucifer. He is now wearing a white turtleneck and silver leather pants (I didn't have a white suit, sorry). He is currently glaring at actual Sam through the foliage of one of my houseplants, but SAM IS SAFE IN THE BARBIE BOXTER WITH DEAN OKAY.
2. DUSTY IMPALA IS DUSTY. I say this because the Car usually indicates Dean's mental image. If he is letting his car get all dirty he is not as happy as he claims.
3. MORAL OUTRAGE. I am really not pleased with Dean taking Cas to see a prostitute. I do not really buy this whole idea that most prostitutes at large are making positive, pro-sex choices with their lives, THOUGH I'M SURE some are. I can't stand the thought of Dean forcing Cas into that situation where he feels so wrong about what he is doing.... I guess with Dean and his own prostitute, he was being fairly respectful.... but I really just DON'T APPROVE AT ALL. Why does it seem so different to me, the idea that Dean would kind of find Cas a date?? or a hookup even?? there are just so many issues of dubious consent with prostitution that it really bothers me, because I do think that most prostitutes are just this close to being slaves, trapped in a situation through violence, coersion, or addiction, and it JUST BOTHERS ME OKAY. On top of that, it was perplexing. Dean has no history of going to prostitutes. In Sin City when he was propositioned by a prostitute, he turned her down, and that was the same writer (Jeremy Carver). It just felt so weak and stereotyped. And why was Dean laughing when he exited the back door with Cas?? FORCED. Unfunny. What the hell? SOMEBODY MAKE ME FEEL BETTER ABOUT THIS OKAY??
4. I am only coping with the idea that Sam is Lucifer Vessel and Dean is Michael Vessel by denying that it will ever actually come to that. No no no. Both Cheesy and Predictable. please show don't go there with bro v bro. LAME.
5. Okay, maybe I am a little bit interested in the idea that Sam and Dean are like somehow Uber Vessels. And yet they still can't hear Angelic true Voice? DOES NOT COMPUTE.
6. I liked that Bobby is at home and coping with his wheelchair issue. I also liked that Bobby straight up told Sam he is the best hunter in the area. I hope that what Sam will learn is that he is better than the demon blood.
7. I liked how Jess came to Sam and it was Lucifer. Nice. I also liked how the actor makes Lucifer so reasonable and sympathetic. I wonder if he is working for God? I always like stories where Satan is actually working for God all along. Though this is unlikely considering how he psychologically tormented Nick into consenting.
8. I REALLY LIKED RAPHAEL. VERY SYMPATHETIC INDEED. Much more so than middle manager Z. I kind of like how Raphael accuses Castiel of being the Rebellious Angel, when clearly Castiel is much more God-focused and in the right than the ones who are bringing on the Apocalypse. Everything Raphael said was full of despair. Despair as a motivation for blasphemy works really well for me. I buy it.
9. I don't mind the Castiel and Dean Show, but here's why : NOT because it gives the writers an opportunity to have Castiel say stupid, inappropriate things, give himself a beer mustache, or be forced into awkward situations by Dean -- but because it gives an opportunity for Castiel to flap flap flap away when Dean gets busy with how much fun he is having with Cas as opposed to Sam. INAPPROPRIATE DEAN. Castiel is not looking for God to have fun! He sacrificed everything because YOU TOLD HIM FAMILY WAS PARAMOUNT. And now you're all like "FAMILY SUCKS. DEAN JUST WANNA HAVE FUNN." Grr, Dean. Grrrrrr.
10. *** THEOLOGY WARNING***
--actual attempt at theology, not krippish--
This absent God thing reminds me a little of how Destruction of the Endless went AWOL. Like he just got too sad to do the job. I wonder if it would be believable for God to become so saddened by humanity's destructive choices that God just goes AWOL? I also wonder if God was worried that the Angels were too much like automatons and wanted to let them make some choices for a change? That sucks for them though, because they are doing SO BADLY. I guess the Angels wanting to create a Paradise on Earth, seems like a good idea, for them -- but they want it for the wrong reasons -- if we go by what Raphael said, they are just tired and want it ALL TO END. They have no respect for humanity -- just like the reason Lucifer fell in the first place. If God is found, how will God justify the fact that the Angels felt completely sure God was dead? That seems awfully irresponsible of God. Would I go away and not tell my children and just let them think I was dead? NO. Something is awry there.
Can I use my tag for "dean is everybody's moral compass?" NO NOT REALLY. :(
Here is my reaction:
ARRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHH!
Here is how I am coping:
1. I immediately got out my doll of Sam's Evil Twin and dressed him as Lucifer. He is now wearing a white turtleneck and silver leather pants (I didn't have a white suit, sorry). He is currently glaring at actual Sam through the foliage of one of my houseplants, but SAM IS SAFE IN THE BARBIE BOXTER WITH DEAN OKAY.
2. DUSTY IMPALA IS DUSTY. I say this because the Car usually indicates Dean's mental image. If he is letting his car get all dirty he is not as happy as he claims.
3. MORAL OUTRAGE. I am really not pleased with Dean taking Cas to see a prostitute. I do not really buy this whole idea that most prostitutes at large are making positive, pro-sex choices with their lives, THOUGH I'M SURE some are. I can't stand the thought of Dean forcing Cas into that situation where he feels so wrong about what he is doing.... I guess with Dean and his own prostitute, he was being fairly respectful.... but I really just DON'T APPROVE AT ALL. Why does it seem so different to me, the idea that Dean would kind of find Cas a date?? or a hookup even?? there are just so many issues of dubious consent with prostitution that it really bothers me, because I do think that most prostitutes are just this close to being slaves, trapped in a situation through violence, coersion, or addiction, and it JUST BOTHERS ME OKAY. On top of that, it was perplexing. Dean has no history of going to prostitutes. In Sin City when he was propositioned by a prostitute, he turned her down, and that was the same writer (Jeremy Carver). It just felt so weak and stereotyped. And why was Dean laughing when he exited the back door with Cas?? FORCED. Unfunny. What the hell? SOMEBODY MAKE ME FEEL BETTER ABOUT THIS OKAY??
4. I am only coping with the idea that Sam is Lucifer Vessel and Dean is Michael Vessel by denying that it will ever actually come to that. No no no. Both Cheesy and Predictable. please show don't go there with bro v bro. LAME.
5. Okay, maybe I am a little bit interested in the idea that Sam and Dean are like somehow Uber Vessels. And yet they still can't hear Angelic true Voice? DOES NOT COMPUTE.
6. I liked that Bobby is at home and coping with his wheelchair issue. I also liked that Bobby straight up told Sam he is the best hunter in the area. I hope that what Sam will learn is that he is better than the demon blood.
7. I liked how Jess came to Sam and it was Lucifer. Nice. I also liked how the actor makes Lucifer so reasonable and sympathetic. I wonder if he is working for God? I always like stories where Satan is actually working for God all along. Though this is unlikely considering how he psychologically tormented Nick into consenting.
8. I REALLY LIKED RAPHAEL. VERY SYMPATHETIC INDEED. Much more so than middle manager Z. I kind of like how Raphael accuses Castiel of being the Rebellious Angel, when clearly Castiel is much more God-focused and in the right than the ones who are bringing on the Apocalypse. Everything Raphael said was full of despair. Despair as a motivation for blasphemy works really well for me. I buy it.
9. I don't mind the Castiel and Dean Show, but here's why : NOT because it gives the writers an opportunity to have Castiel say stupid, inappropriate things, give himself a beer mustache, or be forced into awkward situations by Dean -- but because it gives an opportunity for Castiel to flap flap flap away when Dean gets busy with how much fun he is having with Cas as opposed to Sam. INAPPROPRIATE DEAN. Castiel is not looking for God to have fun! He sacrificed everything because YOU TOLD HIM FAMILY WAS PARAMOUNT. And now you're all like "FAMILY SUCKS. DEAN JUST WANNA HAVE FUNN." Grr, Dean. Grrrrrr.
10. *** THEOLOGY WARNING***
--actual attempt at theology, not krippish--
This absent God thing reminds me a little of how Destruction of the Endless went AWOL. Like he just got too sad to do the job. I wonder if it would be believable for God to become so saddened by humanity's destructive choices that God just goes AWOL? I also wonder if God was worried that the Angels were too much like automatons and wanted to let them make some choices for a change? That sucks for them though, because they are doing SO BADLY. I guess the Angels wanting to create a Paradise on Earth, seems like a good idea, for them -- but they want it for the wrong reasons -- if we go by what Raphael said, they are just tired and want it ALL TO END. They have no respect for humanity -- just like the reason Lucifer fell in the first place. If God is found, how will God justify the fact that the Angels felt completely sure God was dead? That seems awfully irresponsible of God. Would I go away and not tell my children and just let them think I was dead? NO. Something is awry there.
Can I use my tag for "dean is everybody's moral compass?" NO NOT REALLY. :(
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no subject
Date: 2009-09-25 09:46 pm (UTC)3. Um, ok. I understand and even agree with your view of prostitution (i.e. it's a forced situation in more cases than some and moral aspect used in this show is dodgy at best). But I don't think the Dean in Season three is the Dean we now see before us. He comes across to me as a bit more despairing, a bit more reckless. Which is why I can see him going to a whorehouse to have a little fun and even bringing the angel along. And notice that Dean wasn't actually going to a room with one. He was just chatting, probably until Castiel was... *ahem*... finished. When Dean was laughing at the end, I didn't view it as forced, so much as it like a dam burst and he was letting out some emotion he'd had bottled inside for so long.
4. The Sam/Lucifer and Dean/Michael thing may be stereotypical, but I for one have never come up against it. That said, I am actually hoping for a showdown of brother against brother. Though from your perspective I imagine would not be fun. Not fun at all. :(
9.Now as for that speech Dean gave about not having to care about Sam anymore and just having fun, I think I speak for the majority when I say that was a load of BS. I mean seriously, the look on his face when he said it was pretty similar to the look he gave that demon in Sin City when he said he wasn't scared of going to hell.
Right now though, I'm not really upset about Dean's current behavior and actions. It hurts and it's quite upsetting when you're in the moment, but I simply remember that Dean is so BROKEN right now. He has been to hell and back, watched his brother turn into something he fought all his life to protect him from, and now the world has gone...well, damn near apocalyptic. He's not exactly going to be making smart decisions or behaving the way we're used to.
As for your other points, I agree more or less. On the whole though, I'm actually liking what I see so far. Really looking forward to the next episode.
no subject
Date: 2009-09-26 02:22 am (UTC)I was literally covering my face with my hands and going NO NO NO! --- it seems like it might be some sort of squick, huh. :P
no subject
Date: 2009-09-26 02:32 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-09-26 01:17 am (UTC)Can I just say I love your brain?
Anyway, my thought about the whole WINCHESTER VS. WINCHESTER THURSDAY THURSDAY THURSDAY!!!! smackdown is: isn't it interesting what they're setting up? And won't it be interesting when the boys decide *not* to kill one another and fix it collaboratively?
If an Angel says God's been gone a long time, we can only surmise that S/He's been gone a very long time indeed.
Your Destruction of the Endless parallel is interesting. I think God just went off to do His own thing and lost track of time.
no subject
Date: 2009-09-26 02:36 am (UTC)I think too that the bros. and their bond of brotherly love will triumph over these supernatural machinations. It just worries me a little!!
no subject
Date: 2009-09-27 03:49 am (UTC)She was in New Jersey playing skee-ball, of course! (She was not, however, Alanis Morrissette.)
(I really do want somebody to write the Dogma/SPN crossover. Is Rufus the hunter really the thirteenth Disciple?)
no subject
Date: 2009-09-26 02:24 am (UTC)Not sure if I can, but here's my two cents.
It's gonna sound weird and maybe a little offensive, but I was actually relieved when the scene opened to the "den of iniquity." I need to do a ton of reading on the subject before my thoughts coalesce on the feminist side of prostitution vs the very compelling reasons you cite to be against it. However, when Dean told Castiel they were going out to get Cas laid, and I imagined how that could go, I was very nervous they'd go hit up a woman in a bar who wasn't a prostitute. That possibility, to me, would have been exploitative and shallow, by dint of Dean and Cas having to play it a little deceptive in order to get what they want. The lounge they wind up in, where everybody is on the same wavelength, actually seemed like a more appropriate choice, since there was no deception or manipulation going on. So despite the way this kind of was a little fail-y, I think it could have been worse and am glad it wasn't.
Hope that made sense. :)
no subject
Date: 2009-09-26 02:54 am (UTC)I think there is a very important feminist argument to be made on behalf of sex-positive thinking. Women should be empowered to make sexual choices to satisfy their own desires (however complex, non-traditional, or, traditional they may be). I guess maybe I have some sort of squick that Castiel triggered with his very obvious discomfort-- like, what was Dean trying to accomplish, if Cas was so unhappy? I've always seen Dean as sex-positive and respectful, --though clearly eager to get into someone's pants should the opportunity present itself. I was shocked that he would put himself and Castiel in the position of paying, rather than picking someone up, because I feel like in the pickup, the woman always has the chance to pull back -- at least when dealing with Dean, cause I truly don't think he would pressure anyone to seal the deal.
I wonder if it will be as squicky for me on the rewatch now that several people have posted some alternative views.
Thanks again!